Behind the C-Suite- Insights from a Former COO on Leading Operations with Cameron Herald

This is the Beyond the Story podcast, a show that goes way beyond the story.

And now, Sebastian Rusk

Sebastian Rusk

Cameron, welcome to the show. Hey, Sebastian.

Cameron Herold

Thanks for having me. Hey, thanks for taking some time out of your day to hang out with me for a few minutes here and share your story. It's great to connect with you. I know that we're part of the same mastermind group with the great Dan Martell. I'm one of the newbies in the group here, and the best way to meet new people I've found, and I'm sure you've continued to experience over the past seven years, is inviting them to be on your podcast. So glad that we got a chance to have a conversation today. So I love telling people's story. on this show. So for context, for our listeners, let's back up a little bit and go back to the beginning of the story. You can define where the beginning is for you. Talk a little bit about your backstory and what really brought you to present day with what you're doing with C-level executives.

Sebastian Rusk

I guess I I'd been groomed as an entrepreneur had run a number of different companies and, um, had played really the de facto second command role for a couple of brands. I was the, um, uh, minority partner and the head of corporate development for what became Boyd auto body in Canada and Gerber auto collision in the United States. I was then hired as president of a private currency company, similar to what Bitcoin is doing. We did it 24 years ago. We had 30,000 companies using our digital currency instead of the U S dollar. We sold that company. Then i joined my best friend and became his CEO and he had a brand called the rubbish boys he was flipping it over to be calling at one eight hundred got junk and so i joined brian as his CEO and we took the company from fourteen employees to three thousand one hundred employees and six and a half years and i was the CEO for that whole tenure. left there 17 years ago, and since then I've been paid to speak in 29 countries. I've written six books on business. Dan and I have been a member of three or four different mastermind communities together over the last 12 years. And then from doing that, got kind of behind the scenes, almost like a, I used to call myself the back pocket COO, that I was in the back pocket of all these CEOs and they would pull me out to give them advice and help them scale. right now i'm helping dining tommy mellow he's hired me to coach him for a full year helping him with a one garage and i'm inside of these brands kind of as their secret weapon helping them scale. And then eight years ago i started a group called the ceo alliance because there were so many mastermind communities for ceos. But there was no community for their ceo to help them get the skills and the confidence and connections to grow themselves and the brands that's kind of my backstory.

Love that. So you've been up to just a couple, two, three things over the past 17 years, huh?

What do you think about hundred million dollar companies?

I love that. I love that. So what do you think about this whole new wave of fractional C-level executives?

Well, it's interesting. So when I left 1-800-GOT-JUNK 17 years ago, I called myself the back pocket COO because I was a fractional COO for some brands, but there wasn't the term fractional, right? There was these, these people that you hire, these hired guns, you brought in that one was nurse next door. Another was called I love rewards and they couldn't afford to have me full time. You know, back then I was getting paid $320,000 by 1-800-GOT-JUNK. They didn't have 320 grand to pay me 17 years ago, but if they paid me 120 grand, And i could come in i could leave meetings i could be on their board i could do advisory i can help them do interviews i could run strategy help the run their quarterlies. It was huge for them to come in with that level of insights and then if i could step back and let their team execute. Can i drop in every couple of weeks it was really powerful so i think that trend is really continued over now where. An entrepreneurial company, a $1 million, $10 million business can't afford a true CFO, or they can't afford a true CMO. A real C-level executive has to come in with strategic insight, P&L responsibility, a level of autonomy, the ability to tell the company what to do. Most companies have given away big titles to very junior people. You really have a director of finance and you gave him a CFO title. I think the trend around these fractionals is actually quite strong. if you know what you're hiring to do and if you can actually kind of put the guidelines or the goal post in place because i think you can go horribly sideways right you have these very smart people that can come in and take your company off in very different directions if you actually show them the path you want to go and they can really help you get there.

Yeah. I love that. Oh, I'm seeing a big, a big growing trend specifically in, in, within the mastermind community as well. A lot of members of, of masterminds on there. I know several fractional CFOs my actual money coach who's a few years older than my daughter has done extremely well with her, with her coaching business. She's not a, she's not a a CPA or accountant or a CFO, But she's so good with numbers and so good with money planning that she has launched a fractional CFO business because she was already doing the work anyway. And she's 26, 27 years old doing exceptionally well. I mean, a complete prodigy. But when I see.

Yes, that's actually what's happened now is because people can actually do their role for five companies instead of for one. And we don't get sucked into the rest of the day to day and the minutiae and the replying alls and the meetings you shouldn't be in. You can actually show up as that expert and just do your expertise. And then, you know, the rest of the time, you don't need to be involved in all the day to day that kind of suck the energy out of most people.

Should we need to get the head of podcasting on the C suite? I mean, I, I take on a couple of those two, two, three of those gigs. No problem. Play golf on Fridays.

I think if more companies understood that the podcast episode itself is not actually what's going to scale up your brand and your marketing, it's what you do with the podcast, right? Even I, one of my six books is called free PR and it's not about being on the podcast as a guest. It's what I can do with all those episodes that I'm on. How many times I can share it with my email list. all the backlinks I can get, put it on my press page, sharing it three times a year on Facebook, three times a year on LinkedIn, slicing it up into shorts that I can actually post. There's so many different things that you can do with the episodes. But so many people think, oh, if I'm on a podcast, I'm going to be famous. No, we were on Oprah back in 2003. But it's not the fact that we were on Oprah for that one day. It's what we did with it for 21 years.

Yeah. And that's specifically what I teach. I mean, I'm, I'm deeply passionate because I've lived it and continue to live it. Yeah. Who do you get to become as a human being, as a business owner, as an entrepreneur, as your role in the company, whatever it may be, because you made a decision to start a podcast. And then on top of that, what relationships and opportunities are being created and, and identified. through the podcast interview process, and then after, just like you had mentioned, what's possible with extracting microcontent and getting a social media strategy consistent and in place because of the podcast. I steer clear away from you're going to be the next Joe Rogan and have a million downloads and make a bazillion dollars from sponsors. Most people are never going to get there, but most people can step into a completely different version of themselves, become a better communicator, increase their content game and build relationships with it. So we speak a lot of the same language. I absolutely love what you're sharing here. Speaking of podcasts, let's talk about what you've done for the past seven years with your show, because we were chatting for a few minutes before we started this episode, and I just love hearing success stories like this. But everything you shared for me, the first thing I took from that was all of this happened because you did the work. And on top of doing the work, you stayed committed to it. And here you are seven years later. Let's talk about what that journey has looked like.

Yeah, I also began with the end in mind, right? I think Stephen Covey talks about begin with the end in mind and seven habits of highly effective people. So I knew the end game of the reason I was starting the Second In Command podcast wasn't to be a podcaster. It wasn't to sell ads on my channel. It was absolutely to build my brand in a space about COOs so that I could use that as a marketing tool to grow my business, which is the COO Alliance. So I have this large network of Second In Commands. My podcast was simply a vehicle for that. And the fact that I could share that and amplify every episode that I was the host on multiple times on Facebook and LinkedIn and Instagram and Twitter and YouTube and TikTok and on my email list and send it to the speakers bureaus that represent me and push it in front of my potential clients. It was that huge social proof and i could hijack the brands are in the audiences of all of my guests right if i was actually helping them share their episode today i just filmed an episode over in the uae in dubai and i was meeting with the marketing team of the c.o.o. that i just had on the show teaching them what they're gonna then be able to do with the episode in dubai well i know that everybody in dubai is gonna hear it cuz one of the big brands over here So if I help them, it helps me. It's kind of the Jerry Maguire, right? So very cognizant in doing it. But yeah, it takes a lot of work to get to the night before you become the overnight success, too. I think we're getting the biggest month we ever had was 100,000 downloads. We hover, though, around the 50,000 monthly downloads right now.

That's fantastic. That's great. Well, I'm wishing you ongoing success with that. It feels like you've got a really good handle on it. In fact, I've been a podcaster for 14 years and been all in for the past eight years. We're going into our ninth year, which is wild to even say, with helping people launch podcasts. I got to say, this is one of the unique stories that have come out with, you know, through, of course, it's being shared on my podcast, uh, as hearing that, but it just, it gets me excited and, and, and rejuvenates my thought process. The same thing kind of happened a couple months back in Washington, DC. I went to podcast movement, phenomenal show. I didn't know why I was going. I just said, well, it's a good look for my brand. And I never really know who I ended up signing up with a speaking company. to rebrand my speaking business while I was at a podcast conference. But all the big brands were there. The iHeartRadios and Spotify and NASA. NASA has three podcasts, who knew? But what it did is it reminded me that we're really just getting started with all this, but like all these large brands, we were at the, after the closing I heart party at top golf. And I was with an ad agency based out of LA and just a fun group. And they did one of the people in the group said, um, Hey, if you have any shows that you've launched that are getting at least 50,000 downloads per episode, we do bill Mars podcast and Theo Vons and a few other celebrities on here, you know, let me know. We can make them some real cash. And I said, well, I'm, I'm working more of the small business, solo entrepreneurs. I work, do work with brands from time to time, but it's good to know. And I walk, I walked out of that coin. Like we are just getting started and there is a plethora of money to be made within here. And I think that this is just the infancy still, and it's been around for a minute now.

Well, and it's interesting. So many people are like, oh, if I build a big podcast, I'm a very, very close personal friend with Jordan Harbinger. Jordan and I were in Laos and Vietnam together. We were literally on Signal together five minutes ago messaging. I've known Jordan for 12 years. And Jordan's a massive podcast, makes millions of dollars a year selling ads on his podcast. And he's like, you could sell ads on your podcast. I'm like, first, I don't have anywhere near the amount of downloads to make enough money off selling ads on my podcast. And I have two inserts on my second in command podcast. One is about my invest in your leaders course. The other is about the COO Alliance. So if I just keep pushing my two products that I make a hundred percent of the gross margin on instead of somebody's ad and they're gonna pay me 500 bucks an episode or 2000. So my podcast is a vehicle for my brands. But again, that's a strategic way to think about it. Right.

I do the same exact thing. That's why I'd ask you. I mean, I'm not a COO, so I'm not going to come on your show, but that's always, I always ask if a fellow podcaster, let's do a podcast swap. And if you're not a podcaster, well, let's definitely get you on the podcast. In fact, I've had, this week has been back to back to back with people from Dan's group that I want to meet, but they also want to start a podcast. And I've lived this for the past eight years, never meant for that to happen, Cameron, ever. I didn't think, but I had a few people on the show years ago, And they're like, Hey, this is really cool what you're doing.

And I said, yeah, what's the best way? What's the best way for a podcaster to get more listeners of the right listeners? Is it to share it on social? Is it to do podcast swaps? Is it to get like the. What do you do?

I think it's your, I think it's your, I think it's your, I think it's your framework on what you've done for the past seven years, being able to use it as a vehicle to grow your brand aligned yourself and been laser focused. It is COOs or it is nothing. I know exactly what I'm going to do with this is my own billboard, my own platform to market my own stuff that I make a hundred percent of the money from. And then as you've seen, I mean, those 100,000 downloads in one month is that that's, you know, those aren't tiny numbers. by any stretch of the imagination. So my first hunch is doubling down on what you've already been doing on there. I don't think there's any special sauce. And I get asked this question often, and I often tell people when I'm asked, you should continue doing what you're doing and maybe double down on it. Because I've found

That's exactly what we're doing. We're reaching out now to every private equity firm, every venture capital firm, and all of the guests that were on the How I Built This podcast to get their COO on mine. But we're looking for all the venture-backed and all the PE-backed firms that are tech companies. And then we're going after all the Bay Area, Chicago, and New York PR firms to get their clients' COOs on our podcast. And we just figured that if we can get the right brands who already believe in marketing and they have that big social push already, that's going to kind of amplify it. So if we can help them, it will help us.

Winner, winner, chicken dinner. That's what that sounds like right there with that strategy. I mean, when you're casting your nets further, and it seems to be those are the right...

I'm also going to test having a guest host now as well. I'm curious if people are tired of my voice or my style. So I have one of our former COO Alliance members, and she's got a great personality. She geeks out about the job. And I'm going to have her do four episodes, and we're going to test it and see what the audience thinks of it. And if it's good, I may get some more guest hosts where I get COOs to interview other COOs, because it's not my show. I'm not on there talking. I'm just asking questions. Anybody can ask questions.

This is fantastic. This is usually the stuff that I'm paid to figure out. So this is great to see you as a practitioner being able to go and do all that. I'm excited to see how that goes and testing that out. I'd also test out what it looks like to do the co-host. try a few episodes that way where you guys kind of tag team the episode. And there's a real good dynamic with the guy, guy, girl dynamic. I've, I've found, um, you know, with that, but you, it sounds like you get the, you know, you're, you're doing, obviously it's been you and you can test her out and test you guys together and then test other COOs out. That's fine. And also take some of the work off of your plate of the hosting.

Have you, have you played with that new AI software notebook? I think it's called notebook.fm. No. Dude, dude, holy shit. Okay. You can take notebook.fm and you could take like my book, the second in command or Dan Martell's buy back your time. And you can, you upload the transcript. You just actually just say, cause all of those are already on the internet now. Like it's already fucking been scraped by somebody. You go into notebook.fm and you say, please create a seven minute podcast about Cameron Harold's book, the second in command. Boom, two minutes later, it's a guy and a girl. So what do you think about Cameron's new book? Well, I kind of think it's kind of good. And they're fucking talking back and forth about how good the book is and why he wrote it. It's unbelievably strong. And it literally sounds like two co-hosts. Yeah, it's crazy. It's creepy. It's creepy crazy.

I'm not that shocked by this because I met with a buddy of mine who owns an AI company here in Miami, and they have created an AI moderator for live events. So as a fellow speaker, you can appreciate a good moderator. And we tested it out, and it was like, they gave just the basic information about the panelists that were there, et cetera. And she laughed and had a personality. And like, we were like, we kind of like, took a like jab at her, like non-business, like real world related, like, Hey, what do you like to do in your free time? And she's like, that's not what we're talking about today. Let's get back on topic. And it was like, just to kind of test the robot out a little bit. And I was like, Oh my great voice, great tonality. So mildly concerning in the world of podcasting, but I'm not that concerned because, um, I just don't think anything's going to replace human interaction, actual human

I don't think it's going to replace it, but it's really intriguing, right? So, do you know if the person that was working on it was her name, Iman? I don't know. What the hell is her boyfriend? Tom Muro? Was Tom Muro involved?

I'm not sure. I don't know what the... They created the technology.

It's called Purple Horizons is the name of the brand. That might be them. Let me see if that's her. She's speaking at a Mindvalley event that I'm speaking at in... I don't know if that's her. No, this is an AI expert.

No, it's not a real person. They created her.

Okay, so this woman is an expert on AI and bringing AI into the organizations, and they're creating some stuff. She's speaking at a big event called Mindvalley's Future Human event that I'm speaking at in Dubai next January. I keep hearing about them.

Yeah, it's crazy, man. I keep hearing about them. My friend Peter Kell and Kristen O'Toole are involved with them.

You know them? I know Peter very well.

Very, very well. Yeah. That kid is an Amri. I'm in the middle of his book slash journal right here of something amazing is about to happen. In fact, I just talked to both of them. He's legit. Yesterday. He is. I met him at an event here in Miami, like randomly, like a year ago. And he was hysterical. I met him in, uh, uh, Caitlin and, um, I was just thoroughly impressed with what he was doing. And then I've been following him ever since. And I mean, his success is undeniable and he's just a really cool dynamic guy, but I've seen mind balance. That's what I learned about mind values through them.

Yeah, last time I saw Peter, we were in a cuddle puddle in Estonia in a crazy dungeon mansion party thing. It was, yeah, it was a couple of years ago in Estonia. I'll see him again and he'll be there in Dubai. Yeah, Peter's legit.

Yeah, he really, really is, man. I said, whatever he's doing, I'm listening on here. So, Mal, the world gets smaller and smaller, doesn't it?

It does. I used to say the world is, yeah, yeah, it does. It's small. Well, it's a big world, but a small path.

Correct. I love that. I love that. Well, Cameron, it's been great to connect with you and learn more about you and, uh, you know, everything you've done and continue to do and what you're up to. I'm, I'm encouraged as a podcast launcher and, and, and fellow podcaster and speaker as well, um, with, with what you're up to and what you're doing on here. So I just want to encourage you to keep up the great work. It's a privilege to now be connected with you and anything I can do to serve you on, on my end, in the podcast world, don't hesitate to let me know any final thoughts for our listeners.

Yeah, I actually got it tattooed on my arm. We're all just walking each other home. None of this shit matters. This is just what we do to make money. The real stuff that matters is our friends and our relationship with ourself and our spouse. you know, that, that I think we all take ourselves or can take ourselves so effing seriously. And at the end of the day, we're all going to end up as kebabs, right? We're just going to end up as like meat on sticks. So I think enjoy the journey and take care of the people that you get to have it with it because it's a pretty cool journey.

Absolutely. That's fantastic. Final thoughts. Thanks again, Cameron. I appreciate your time, brother. All right, Sebastian. Thanks for having me. You got it until next time, friends.

Thanks so much for tuning into this episode of the Beyond the Story podcast. We sure do appreciate it. If you haven't done so already, make sure you're subscribed to the show. This way you'll get updates as new episodes become available. If you feel so inclined, please leave us a review. We sure do appreciate it. Signing off from the podcast, Launchlab.com Studios. We'll talk to you next time.